الطب فى أستراليا

[Ihab]

salam alykom every one

I just wanted to post a personal experience which might affect future doctors seeking employment in australia.

My wife has the first part pf the amc and the ielts and a valid working visa (as she is on my visa) and she has been applying for jobs for the last 6 months from here,

She got only one interview, no job offers

the last job she applied for we learned that before the closing date there was around 90 applicants for the job and around 40 of them were permanent residents and round 10 or so had general registration

As per the new regulations for working that i posted here before they prioritize PR first then Working visa holders then non visa holders and they prioritize GR holders first then those who have both parts of the amc and then those who have only the first part

The numbers now are approaching the numbers in the UK before they shut every thing down in the face of overseas doctors and they have reached that stage quite quickly unlike the expecatation of every one

When i applied for my first job here mid 2006 i was the only suitable candidate for the job and now they have 90 candidates for the job and that is only in 3 years

probably this applies more now to the more urban areas and the numbers are probably still better in the rural areas but i don't have a valid number to quote here

So my wife is now having a course for the amc 2 and there are 74 other candidates in the course and they all have the first part and the english and nearly none of them is working and it is the consensus of every one there that it is virtually impossible now to find a job with the first part and the english

SO i would like to take back the numbers that i quoted in my first post here , so at this stage my impression is

if you have the first part and the english your chances are less than 10%

if you have both parts and the english your chances are probably around 20-30%

if you have both parts and the english and a valid working visa and you apply directly to hospitals your chances are probably around 40-50%

and at this stage if you have both parts of the amc and the english and a valid working visa and you apply to the IMET or similar recruitment campaigns in other states for an intern job your chances are fairly high around 90% i would say

As i said this rapid changes in the medical workforce here was much faster than any one expected but this is the reality to the best of my knowledge and i hope this information will be useful for all of you on deciding where you wanna go from here

If i can end this depressing post by one piece of good news i think it will be the recruitment campaign for 2010 which is gonna start in NSW next week and the following link has all the details

http://www.health.nsw.gov.au/jobs/recruitment/jmo.asp

So any one who has the first and the english should be searching for these jobs now as no one knows what the situation will be like next year

[icehell]

@ Dr.Ihab

what are the duties of General practitioner doctor in AUZ?

the rules of selection for the new jobs as you mentioned applied to Rural areas too?

[Ihab]

@ Dr.Ihab

what are the duties of General practitioner doctor in AUZ?

the rules of selection for the new jobs as you mentioned applied to Rural areas too?

The GP here , some times called the family doctor or the local doctor, is the first point of contact for the patients for non urgent matters

so if someone is acutely sick they go to the ED, if nothing acute though they visit their GP

SO basically he oversees the whole medical condition of the patient, arranges appropriate tests and refers the patient to specialists if needed, treats chronic conditions and liaise with the different specialists if necessary

some GPs have special interests in O&G or paeds masalan which gives them the advantage of deeper managment of relevant conditions and some of them especially in the rural areas are experts in certain procdures like CS masalan so they can manage complicated pregnancies on their own without the need for referral to a specialist, those ones usually get paid very well

the rules of selection for the rural areas are the same for the urban areas unless you are applying for an AON (area of need) job which is much more complicated and usually only suitable for those with a considerable experience who can peroform indepedently without the need for direct supervision

[Dr.mmfriend]

[Dr.mmfriend]

الكلام ده يا دكتور فى سيدنى والاماكن الكبيرة ولا كل استراليا؟؟؟؟

يعنى نصرف نظر ولا ايه؟؟

[غريب الخبر]

Thank you D. Ihab,

please,always keep us updated with new events .

[magdeaaa]

مساء الخير للجميع

بصراحة مداخلة قوية وجميلة جدا يا دكتور ايهاب

بصراحة الواحد هيك راح يعيد ترتيب اوراقوا ,لانوا افهمنا النظام كيف ماشي وشو راح يصير بعد سنة او سنتين

على العموم الله يجيب يلي فية الخير للجميع

[Ihab]

Wallahi so far and to the best of my knowledge the situation is definitely worse in sydney and the big cities in terms of competition for the jobs

i can't really answer the question whether you should continue your efforts to come to australia or forget about it as this is largely dependent on every person's risk profile and personal circumstances

But i am definitely not as enthusiastic i was before in encouraging people to come to australia

I don't think that australia will have legislative changes soon like what happened in the UK to restrict jobs for a particular area of the world like the EU masalan, because in case of the UK they were bound with the rest of the EU with certain trade and work regulations

However, they make it clear that they prefer doctors coming from this part of the world and this is evident in the competent authority pathway which was introduced around 2 years ago

I guess what i am trying to say is that the oportunity will still be there may be for a couple more years but god knows what will happen afterwards, so if you anticipate you are gonna start your pathway to australia in a year or two i would urge you to recalculate your chances and reconsider your options

If, however, you have already started and done your first and/or the english then by all means you should continue the pathway and try and look for a job while you still can

I am trying to give you the picture as i see it hoping that this would help you make your decision, i can't make that decisions though as obviously every one thinks differently and has different circumstances and priorities

[Dr.mmfriend]

طيب وبالنسبه لنيوزيلاندا !!!

انا اعرف ان الترخيص بتاع استراليا ممكن تشتغل بيه فى نيوزيلاندا

بقول يعنى لو مجاتش دي تبقي دي!!

ولا ايييييه؟

[YaserK]

طيب وبالنسبه لنيوزيلاندا !!!

انا اعرف ان الترخيص بتاع استراليا ممكن تشتغل بيه فى نيوزيلاندا

بقول يعنى لو مجاتش دي تبقي دي!!

ولا ايييييه؟

ازاي هتاخد ترخيص في استراليا من غير ما تشتغل فيها؟؟ من شروط التسجيل الغير مشروط في استراليا انك تكون اشتغلت سنة فيها. يعني لو ملقتش شغل يبقى مفيش ترخيص, يبقى بردو مفيش نيوزيلاند

تم تعديل 12 يوليو 2009 بواسطة YaserK

[annas]

السلام علي الجميع

بص يا دكتر ايهاب اتعشم انك ترد عليا المره دي

فيه واحد صاحبي حاليا بيعمل ماجستير طب اسره جامعه موناش online عشان يسافر بيه السعوديه

المهم انا لو عملت الماستر ده بعد او مع الamc part 1 هل كده ممكن يزود فرص الشغل ليه؟

وهل ده يخليني specialist

:blink: wst:: mfb: :lol: wst:: :ninja:

[Ihab]

السلام علي الجميع

بص يا دكتر ايهاب اتعشم انك ترد عليا المره دي

فيه واحد صاحبي حاليا بيعمل ماجستير طب اسره جامعه موناش online عشان يسافر بيه السعوديه

المهم انا لو عملت الماستر ده بعد او مع الamc part 1 هل كده ممكن يزود فرص الشغل ليه؟

وهل ده يخليني specialist

:blink: wst:: mfb: :lol: wst:: :ninja:

Dr. Anass

when you apply for any job you are in a direct competition with all the other applicants

so if you have better qualifications you will get the job

so anything that improves your application or your CV theoritically improves your chances

the master doesn't make you a specialist though, to be a specialist in anything you have to satisfy the requirments of the relevant royal college which is usually a number of years of training plus passing certain exams

[Dr.mmfriend]

السلام عليكم

فيه ناس كانوا بيقترحوا انك تاخد بعد الفيرست الجزء الاول من امتحان التخصص لكليه معينه

زى الجزء الاول من زماله الكليه الاستراليه للطب العام او الطوارىء

ما مدى امكانيه تطبيق الموضوع ده؟؟

هل بيقبلوا ولا لا؟؟

[jukass]

Wallahi so far and to the best of my knowledge the situation is definitely worse in sydney and the big cities in terms of competition for the jobs

i can't really answer the question whether you should continue your efforts to come to australia or forget about it as this is largely dependent on every person's risk profile and personal circumstances

But i am definitely not as enthusiastic i was before in encouraging people to come to australia

I don't think that australia will have legislative changes soon like what happened in the UK to restrict jobs for a particular area of the world like the EU masalan, because in case of the UK they were bound with the rest of the EU with certain trade and work regulations

However, they make it clear that they prefer doctors coming from this part of the world and this is evident in the competent authority pathway which was introduced around 2 years ago

I guess what i am trying to say is that the oportunity will still be there may be for a couple more years but god knows what will happen afterwards, so if you anticipate you are gonna start your pathway to australia in a year or two i would urge you to recalculate your chances and reconsider your options

If, however, you have already started and done your first and/or the english then by all means you should continue the pathway and try and look for a job while you still can

I am trying to give you the picture as i see it hoping that this would help you make your decision, i can't make that decisions though as obviously every one thinks differently and has different circumstances and priorities

السلام عليكم

اول شي اسف على الغيبة اللي طولت لانه كنا بامتحانات وضغط جامد ,, والحمدلله خلصنا الامتحانات على خير وسلامة

تاني شي يسلمو على المشاركات الجديدة والمعلومات الجديدة من الدكتور ايهاب وزياد واخوي صابر وطبعا ما ننسى ياسر

تالت شغلة بحب اعفب على كلام الدكتور ايهاب بشغلة

اني انا بديت اقلق من كلامك يا باشا

يعني اللي زي حالاتي وحالات مجدي دوبنا مخلصبن اخر سنة سادسة وما استلمنا امتياز ,,, نعيد حساباتنا ؟؟؟

انته فعلا غيرت كلامك كتير 180 درجة والارقام والنسب اتقلبت !!!

ايش اللي صار ما انا كنت ماشي كويس وانا والشباب بنجهز للامتحان وبندرس ومش مقصرين .

ونيجي الان نعيد نظر بالموضوع لانه الفرص احتمال ما تكون موجودة لدرجة 10 % بس ؟؟

طيب اذا كان وضعي انا كفلسطيني وما لي بلد ارجعلها واتخصص فيها زي اغلب اللي هنا , وكل الدول رافضة الان استقبال الفلسطيني ( لانه احنا منبوذين ) .

ولما لقيت انه استراليا هي الوحيدة اللي ما عندها مشاكل باستقرار الفلسطيني فيها بعكس بقية الدول زي اميؤكا وكندا وغيره ,,, قلت هادي هي الفرصة .

الكلام اتغير يا دكتور ايهاب بسرعة ,, ايش صار بالفترة اللي فاتت ؟

وايش قصة زوجتك الله يخليلك هيا مع الشغل ومش ملاقية شغل ؟ لانه اذا الوضع هيك اعتقد انه انا مالي مكان بالعالم !!

ماهو اني زعلان منك والا زعلان من كلامك .. بالعكس انا مبسوط على الشفافية والصراحة بالموضوع وانخ كل شي يكون واضح .

بس انا اعتقد انه كفرصة في استراليا لاتزال موجودة بس كيف الواحد يوصلها ؟

وزي ما حكى اخوي صابر ,, انه كان بيدور على شغل وما لقى ؟

طيب اذا كان لي احد هناك ممكن يساعدني والا لا ؟

وهل فرصي حنزيد لو كان لي قريب هناك ويشوفلي شغل مثلا لو كان هو دكتور وشغال ؟

والا هي بس توفيق من ربنا بالاول والاخر

لانه الخطوة الجاية اللي ناوي اسويها هي اني اقدم على امتيازي بالسعودية ان شاء الله

ومنها راح اشوف كيف الوضع راح يمشي .

وربنا يوفق الجميع للخير لكل ما يحبه ويرضاه

[Ihab]

السلام عليكم

فيه ناس كانوا بيقترحوا انك تاخد بعد الفيرست الجزء الاول من امتحان التخصص لكليه معينه

زى الجزء الاول من زماله الكليه الاستراليه للطب العام او الطوارىء

ما مدى امكانيه تطبيق الموضوع ده؟؟

هل بيقبلوا ولا لا؟؟

Talking about medicine that i know most about, the problem is that you have to be registered with the royal australasian college of physicians before you can take the exam

and to be registered with the college you have to be in a training position in an accredited hospital in Australia

so again the chicken and the egg

I think this applies to most specialties but i am not sure if there are specialties that allow you to take the exam while you are not working here

It would defintely make a big difference if you have the first part of any specialty or even if you just register with the relevant royal college before you apply for a job but the difficulty is as i mentioned above

[Ihab]

Wallahi so far and to the best of my knowledge the situation is definitely worse in sydney and the big cities in terms of competition for the jobs

i can't really answer the question whether you should continue your efforts to come to australia or forget about it as this is largely dependent on every person's risk profile and personal circumstances

But i am definitely not as enthusiastic i was before in encouraging people to come to australia

I don't think that australia will have legislative changes soon like what happened in the UK to restrict jobs for a particular area of the world like the EU masalan, because in case of the UK they were bound with the rest of the EU with certain trade and work regulations

However, they make it clear that they prefer doctors coming from this part of the world and this is evident in the competent authority pathway which was introduced around 2 years ago

I guess what i am trying to say is that the oportunity will still be there may be for a couple more years but god knows what will happen afterwards, so if you anticipate you are gonna start your pathway to australia in a year or two i would urge you to recalculate your chances and reconsider your options

If, however, you have already started and done your first and/or the english then by all means you should continue the pathway and try and look for a job while you still can

I am trying to give you the picture as i see it hoping that this would help you make your decision, i can't make that decisions though as obviously every one thinks differently and has different circumstances and priorities

السلام عليكم

اول شي اسف على الغيبة اللي طولت لانه كنا بامتحانات وضغط جامد ,, والحمدلله خلصنا الامتحانات على خير وسلامة

تاني شي يسلمو على المشاركات الجديدة والمعلومات الجديدة من الدكتور ايهاب وزياد واخوي صابر وطبعا ما ننسى ياسر

تالت شغلة بحب اعفب على كلام الدكتور ايهاب بشغلة

اني انا بديت اقلق من كلامك يا باشا

يعني اللي زي حالاتي وحالات مجدي دوبنا مخلصبن اخر سنة سادسة وما استلمنا امتياز ,,, نعيد حساباتنا ؟؟؟

انته فعلا غيرت كلامك كتير 180 درجة والارقام والنسب اتقلبت !!!

ايش اللي صار ما انا كنت ماشي كويس وانا والشباب بنجهز للامتحان وبندرس ومش مقصرين .

ونيجي الان نعيد نظر بالموضوع لانه الفرص احتمال ما تكون موجودة لدرجة 10 % بس ؟؟

طيب اذا كان وضعي انا كفلسطيني وما لي بلد ارجعلها واتخصص فيها زي اغلب اللي هنا , وكل الدول رافضة الان استقبال الفلسطيني ( لانه احنا منبوذين ) .

ولما لقيت انه استراليا هي الوحيدة اللي ما عندها مشاكل باستقرار الفلسطيني فيها بعكس بقية الدول زي اميؤكا وكندا وغيره ,,, قلت هادي هي الفرصة .

الكلام اتغير يا دكتور ايهاب بسرعة ,, ايش صار بالفترة اللي فاتت ؟

وايش قصة زوجتك الله يخليلك هيا مع الشغل ومش ملاقية شغل ؟ لانه اذا الوضع هيك اعتقد انه انا مالي مكان بالعالم !!

ماهو اني زعلان منك والا زعلان من كلامك .. بالعكس انا مبسوط على الشفافية والصراحة بالموضوع وانخ كل شي يكون واضح .

بس انا اعتقد انه كفرصة في استراليا لاتزال موجودة بس كيف الواحد يوصلها ؟

وزي ما حكى اخوي صابر ,, انه كان بيدور على شغل وما لقى ؟

طيب اذا كان لي احد هناك ممكن يساعدني والا لا ؟

وهل فرصي حنزيد لو كان لي قريب هناك ويشوفلي شغل مثلا لو كان هو دكتور وشغال ؟

والا هي بس توفيق من ربنا بالاول والاخر

لانه الخطوة الجاية اللي ناوي اسويها هي اني اقدم على امتيازي بالسعودية ان شاء الله

ومنها راح اشوف كيف الوضع راح يمشي .

وربنا يوفق الجميع للخير لكل ما يحبه ويرضاه

I have definitely changed my tone but i haven't changed 180 degress

From the first post i was saying that things are gonna change soon in here with the increase in number of local graduates and the influx of doctors from the UK

I didn't expect it to be that soon though

SO i was surprised myself and as i said before when i applied in mid 2006 i was the only suitable candidate and now in the same hospital there are 90 candidates for the job

The change has happened much more quickly than i expected

The number of indian and pakistani doctors coming after failing to find a job in the UK has surged in the last year or so and i think that is the main reason why the change happened so quickly

I am trying to convey the picture to you to the best of my knowledge so that when you make any decision it is an informed decision but making the decision itself is up to every person

I would hate to see other people in Saber's position , though he is actually in a good position i think, but he is depressed because he expected to find a job easily after doing the first part which didn't happen

and again that is my point of view and my opinion based on me living and working here, you should use it as a guide only if you wish but i never base my own decisions on just one person's opinion so you should obviously ask more people till you find the decision that is suitable for you with the least possible frustrations

[Dr.mmfriend]

والله انا رايي انه الحياه نفسها كلها مخاطر وانه الواحد لازم يخاطر ويعمل الى عليه

الفيرست والعملى والانجليزى وكورسات BLS ,ACLS,ATLS وخبرك كام سنه و سيرة ذاتيه محترمه على كام recommendation letter من كام واحد كويسين

وربنا المستعان

عموما لو حد عنده طريق تانى يقول عليه مفيش مانع برضه

[YaserK]

اللي أنا فهمته لحد دلوقتي انه خبرة الطبيب و مؤهلاته مش هتكون مؤثرة في اختياره لوظيفة في أستراليا بقدر تأثير وضعه القانوني في البلد.

لو الكمبيوتر بيفلتر المتقدمين لوظيفة معينة بناء على حالتهم القانونية (مواطنين أستراليين, مقيمين دائمين, مقيمين بتصريح عمل, وغير مقيمين), يبقى لو طبيب غير مقيم مؤهلاته وخبرته تفوق الطبيب الأسترالي هيختارو الأسترالي لأن النظام متظبط على كده.

ده نفس المنطق اللي بقى سائد في أوروبا وبريطانيا من حوالي 3 سنين.

يا ريت حد يقولي انا كده فهمت الوضع صح ولا غلط؟

[Ihab]

اللي أنا فهمته لحد دلوقتي انه خبرة الطبيب و مؤهلاته مش هتكون مؤثرة في اختياره لوظيفة في أستراليا بقدر تأثير وضعه القانوني في البلد.

لو الكمبيوتر بيفلتر المتقدمين لوظيفة معينة بناء على حالتهم القانونية (مواطنين أستراليين, مقيمين دائمين, مقيمين بتصريح عمل, وغير مقيمين), يبقى لو طبيب غير مقيم مؤهلاته وخبرته تفوق الطبيب الأسترالي هيختارو الأسترالي لأن النظام متظبط على كده.

ده نفس المنطق اللي بقى سائد في أوروبا وبريطانيا من حوالي 3 سنين.

يا ريت حد يقولي انا كده فهمت الوضع صح ولا غلط؟

That is true

I have actually been told that quite frankly in an interview about 2 years ago, that if a permanent resident or australian citizen applied we will give them priority for the job

The difference in Australia though is that there is still shortage in the medical workforce allowing for the latest category (those with no working visa) to find jobs here because they can't fill the jobs with the other categories

and this shortage is still present but obviously it is being filled quickly with overseas doctors and soon with more australian graduates, only god knows how lond this shortage is gonna last , 2 years ago we thought it is gonna be another 10 years or so before the medical workforce here is saturated but obviously we were wrong and it is filling much quicker than we expected

There is one good thing about the coming recruitment campaign though and that is there are so many jobs being advertised , the australian apply for more than one job (usually 3 or 4) and they usually get offers for all 4 but they have to take only one so 3 jobs will be vacant , so to fill these jobs they do second round offers and in that second round offer the chances of those without working visa is the greatest as the hospitals will be desperate to fill its vacancies before the following year

That is why i encourage any one who is eligible to apply for these jobs (starting from this thursday) apply for all the jobs you can and the more interviews you will get the more chances are you will have a job particulalry in the second round offers

[annas]

hallo dr ihab

may i ask you away from medicine . my wife is newly pregnant and i will plan for having my baby in australia in shaa ALLAH of course.

is australia like america in that issue?

will the baby take the australian nationality?